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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 10 post(s) |
Jack Gilligan
Caldari 1st Cavalry Division Circle-Of-Two
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Posted - 2010.07.28 14:36:00 -
[1]
I'd vote but I am afraid I have two projects completely unrelated to my main job that I won't be able to spare time to do this. Get back to me in 18 months.
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Jack Gilligan
Caldari 1st Cavalry Division Circle-Of-Two
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Posted - 2010.07.28 14:52:00 -
[2]
I would vote for a rollback to Apocrypha. We could actually have fleet fights then.
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Jack Gilligan
Caldari 1st Cavalry Division Circle-Of-Two
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Posted - 2010.07.28 16:35:00 -
[3]
What I'd like to know is what we have to do to get CCP to change their priorities, to convince you that you are seriously jeopardizing this game by staying on your current course? You clearly aren't listening in a constructive way.
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Jack Gilligan
Caldari 1st Cavalry Division Circle-Of-Two
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Posted - 2010.07.28 16:42:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Mica Petrokov
Originally by: iridize My hat goes off to you sir for putting your head above the pa****t, you may get a little abuse aimed at you, but the fact that your the first CCP employee to respond to this thread and acknowledge the players may actually gain you a little respect from the community.
You are well aware that he is also the last CCP employee who will respond to this thread or even be aware of its content, right?
Seriously, the CEO should be reading this, not some flunky that has no ability to do anything about this.
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Jack Gilligan
Caldari 1st Cavalry Division Circle-Of-Two
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Posted - 2010.07.28 17:21:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Jack Gilligan on 28/07/2010 17:22:08
Originally by: SkinSin
Originally by: CCP Manifest I brought up this specific thread in this morning's EVE marketing meeting, and it will appear in my "EVE press mention roundup" email either later today or tomorrow, which is widely read throughout CCP.
Good! I hope you mentioned that retention of existing customers is just as important as getting new ones. Keeping existing customers is easy and is guaranteed income, while enticing new people is more difficult. And given the current game state, the possibility of keeping new players past the trial period seems to be quite small!!
They don't get new customers if they don't satisfy the existing ones. This is one lesson learned from the NGE, SOE deliberately SET OUT to cast off their (then) 200,000+ existing customers because they thought their new direction would net them far more than that. Which of course didn't happen, the fact that the NGE sucked aside, who is going to join a MMO with a ****ed off and rapidly diminishing customer base?
Also, CCP, we don't WANT to be here complaining about the game. We WANT to be able to go to the voting site and vote for this game. Unfortunately though, if you don't change your development priorities to fix the existing problems I'm afraid the logs are going to show you aren't going to win this award. Tyrannous doesn't DESERVE this award.
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Jack Gilligan
Caldari 1st Cavalry Division Circle-Of-Two
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Posted - 2010.07.28 17:32:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Arimathea Anthalas
Originally by: Shadoo :not-sure-if-serious:
Seriously, you gotta be kidding me with this ****.
Quoting this for great justice. C-J was the pinnacle, half the grid nonexistent, friends I couldn't even see who were 5km away getting DD by titans they couldn't even target, locking messages repeating for five minutes and still no lock, these only the most bizarre problems I've seen in my last year of EVE and your company has no clue how to solve it.
The data doesn't support that quality sells better than new features. It's not going to support it either because there is no way I am voting for this tripe.
We couldn't even have a fight in Providence with only 250 in system last weekend. It's pathetic and unacceptable. Back when Apocrypha came out we could have fights larger than that on unreinforced nodes with little or no problems and have fights with over 1,000 on reinforced nodes.
What has happened is because CCP has failed to stop the system from regressing with subsequent releases and we are back to arguably a WORSE position than we were in before Apocrypha. And they won't do anything about it until their current development cycle is done.
Hey CCP, lag DOES have another solution you know, other than investing our money in solving it (rather than developing a console MMOFPS) but that alternative solution isn't palatable: It's called players quitting the game, thus creating less stress on nodes.
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Jack Gilligan
Caldari 1st Cavalry Division Circle-Of-Two
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Posted - 2010.07.28 17:49:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Montar Ran Dont you think now is the time to push the dates for incarn and dust back and fix the lag and everything.... just a thought... i think majority of the player base would enjoy that better.
Their excuse from that one Dev post was that the Devs they have on Incarna and Dust aren't the kind of Devs who could fix the server node performance problem.
Which isn't an excuse at all, it's an admission of failure of management: failure to staff the company with the personnel they need to perform the necessary tasks.
Which is all ultimately the CEO's responsibility.
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Jack Gilligan
Caldari 1st Cavalry Division Circle-Of-Two
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Posted - 2010.07.28 17:54:00 -
[8]
How much you wanna bet the planetary interaction part is what is causing the overstressed nodes, and CCP knows it, and taking that out (which would wipe the whole Tyrranus expansion) is not an option because the whole reason they added it was for DUST514.
No shiny planets, no planetary interaction, no DUST514.
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Jack Gilligan
Caldari 1st Cavalry Division Circle-Of-Two
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Posted - 2010.07.28 19:24:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Jack Gilligan on 28/07/2010 19:24:27
Originally by: Zimi Vlasic
Originally by: CCP Manifest I brought up this specific thread in this morning's EVE marketing meeting, and it will appear in my "EVE press mention roundup" email either later today or tomorrow, which is widely read throughout CCP.
hahahahaha marketing people
Since when has marketing anywhere given a crap about quality?
Consider too that sales and marketing people in almost any organization are the most overpaid, yet least intelligent and knowledgeable members of the staff, only good at schmoozing.
There are two kinds of marketing people apparently: The overly well endowed ex-cheerleaders who become pharmaceutical reps, and the people who aren't who get hired by other companies who end up ruining their products.
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Jack Gilligan
Caldari 1st Cavalry Division Circle-Of-Two
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Posted - 2010.07.28 19:30:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Coehoorn "Vote for us, we're the good guys"
Sorry but.. NO!
Seriously, Complete lag-o-mess with some crazy fail-ideas...and you want an award ? Yup.. The Golden Raspberry in Game Industry.
Maybe you should try that with Dust... but in EvE, you'd better fix that mess first.
Regards.
I vote that the name of the award that Tyrranis deserves should be called:
"The John Smedley award for MMO Mismanagement"
Find me a poll for that award and I'll vote for CCP.
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Jack Gilligan
Caldari 1st Cavalry Division Circle-Of-Two
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Posted - 2010.07.29 02:49:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Monkey M3n I dont see a catagory for laggiest game with terrible customer support so i didnt vote for you.....
BFBC2 FTW!!!!!!!
GO EA GAMES!!!!!
There also isn't a category for "MMO that takes my $15/month and spends it on making a console MMOFPS to the detriment of the live PC game rather than fixes the problems that are a direct result of making it possible for said MMOFPS to interact with it...".
Yeah, Dominion/Tyrranis would win first prize in that category of voting.
Or they could win the "Most deaf dumb and blind Dev team that doesn't work for SOE" category.
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Jack Gilligan
Caldari 1st Cavalry Division Circle-Of-Two
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Posted - 2010.07.29 02:55:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Liang Nuren
Originally by: Monkey M3n GO EA GAMES!!!!!
Do I hear a SOE?
-Liang
As I said earlier in this thread, Hellmar is eligible to win the "John Smedley Award for extreme MMO mismanagement", if that were a category to be voted on.
Yeah, I think we all expected him to never be mentioned in the same breath with the evil Smedster. But it fits unless things change.
If Dominion was EVE's CU, Tyranis is our NGE.
And, no, CCP, you don't have 18 months to fix it. 18 weeks is more like it, and even that is stretching customer patience beyond all reason, considering how long it's already gone broken...
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Jack Gilligan
Caldari 1st Cavalry Division Circle-Of-Two
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Posted - 2010.07.29 16:53:00 -
[13]
Originally by: ItommoI Is there an award for most falsely advertised game?
That would go to anything SOE advertised.
But CCP is clearly walking their path. They clearly are taking our money and spending it on things that aren't for us (Dust514), things we'd rather have our game fixed before they are done (Incarna), or things that are nothing more than fluff (Eve Gate).
CCP thought they were doing damage control with the post detailing their team distribution and numbers, but instead they showed us the extent to which they ignore us.
Well, now they are trying damage control, claiming in an article that fixing the server problems and getting us back to 1,000 ship fleet battles is "priority one". Which is good, don't get me wrong, but why did it taking us unloading on them for a day and a half to get this moved up 18 months?
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Jack Gilligan
Caldari 1st Cavalry Division Circle-Of-Two
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Posted - 2010.07.29 22:37:00 -
[14]
How to find/fix the problem:
1. Load Sisi with Apocrypha 1.5 code (ie: the last version of the game in which we could have 1,000 in a fight in an unreinforced node with definite but workable lag. Have play test. Collect logs.
2. Load Sisi with current code, run the same test, do regression testing on THE CODE THAT CHANGED IN BETWEEN to figure out what caused the fact that nodes can't even support 1/5th the number of players they did a year ago.
Simply put, CCP has failed to run a proper software development house and has not tested the effects of new code/new features when added to real playing environments and do not do regression (ie: when something goes bad, test to find out what caused it) testing.
The reason why people are so ****ed off is that we KNOW that huge fleet fights ARE POSSIBLE, because WE HAD THEM. That's why we aren't going to tolerate vague platitudes and promises, we want a return of the space game to the state it was in when the new Nehalam nodes and stackless I/O hit.
Also, you need to accelerate development of something you talked about some time ago, that being making the server self load balance. IE: allocate CPU/RAM etc to the nodes that need them in real time. As in, make the nodes reinforce themselves automatically AS THINGS HAPPEN. Fights can happen anywhere at any time. We can't always tell you in advance, because we don't KNOW in advance.
Pull all that off, and you deserve to be voted for an award. Ignore it, add your DUST console kiddz MMO and "The Sims on Stations" update on top of a broken core game and you are going to soon be wondering, "dude, where did my subscriber base go?".
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Jack Gilligan
Caldari 1st Cavalry Division Circle-Of-Two
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Posted - 2010.07.30 12:51:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Liranan Edited by: Liranan on 30/07/2010 12:36:17
Quote: It was mentioned by CCP that the data does not seem to support that polished quality sells better than new features.
How can we vote for EVE when then data doesn't support us voting for existing features?
I'd like to know where they got that data from when their logs never show anything.
Hell, any decent sysadmin knows their "our logs show nothing" line is either a lie or an admission of gross negligence. The servers I handle are nowhere near as complex as TQ, of course, but one thing that one can't say about a Windows server is that there are no logs. There are logs for EVERYTHING, even pure minutia.
Their "study" that shows that their "data" doesn't support the assertion that we want our game to actually work right more than we want more non working stuff to be added comes from the same self-serving insular "groupthink" mentality that led, for example, SOE to think the NGE was a fantastic idea and that they'd be able to replace their existing player base who loved the game as it was with a vast NEW customer base that liked their broken dumbed down version. If they actually have data that suggests that, any audit of what led to it would probably show that they asked the wrong people the wrong questions.
Most people overlook the one innovation that made Wow (much as I hate it and games like it) a success: Polish.
WOW was the first MMO ever to launch that was complete and polished in terms of content and core systems, at a time when everyone released their MMO games in an incomplete and buggy state. That was the only thing new and different they did, their game was (and is) nothing more than a clone of other fantasy RPG MMOs that had come before them, such as Everquest, the only difference being that WOW actually WORKED when it was released.
Consider that data, CCP, before proclaiming that your customers want new and broken stuff more than we want polish. WOW has, what 14 million, EVE has 300,000. If it were true that people wanted new stuff and could care less if game systems worked or not it'd be the other way around (and I know I am oversimplifying) and WOW would have 300,000 while EVE would have millions.
Hell, if this theory was true, how come the Star Wars NGE game is on the verge of closing, probably kept on life support only until TOR releases, instead of a huge runaway success?
Simply put, people don't want to pay for CRAP, we want our games to have core systems that work. We should be able to concentrate on fighting reds in local, not fighting the GAME at the same time!
As I said earlier in this topic, the reason why people are ****ed off for real this time is that we KNOW that CCP can achieve even regular nodes that can handle 1,000+ fighting in system, in laggy but functional conditions BECAUSE WE HAD THIS A YEAR AGO!
We know it CAN be done because it HAS been done. What is unacceptable is that CCP has clearly not maintained the game code in a responsible manner and has allowed subsequent upgrades to degrade the core game systems without bothering to correct it.
That style of software development would get you fired anywhere except at a MMO publisher it seems.
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